RESPONSIBILITY

its not our responsilbility to enforce this law. its unconsitutional to make us obey this law.



1.stereo tech.s dont get sited for installing loud music over the noise limit. 2.stereo tech.s dont get sited for installing dvd players in the front of the drivers seat. 3. truck tech.s dont get sited for installing lift kits on 4x4 that make them 4ft. off the ground. 4. exhaust tech.s dont get sited for installing loud pipes or taking the catylists off. 5. engine tech.s dont get sited for installing nos. or super chargers makeing the auto go well over three times the speed limit. it singles us out of the rest and thats descrimination thats a fact! the responsibility lyes on the auto owner and law enforcment, not you or me or any tint tech. if the insurance com.s have issues with dark tint, dont pay the claims on dark tinted cars. they dont pay claims on houses built on the coast. if law enforcment have issues with dark tint, make the fines stiffer i think a $75 fine is too leineant. it should be $275. appeared in court today for installing dark tint on my work truck. my trial date is 7-17-08 ill let you all know the outcome on GOT BUSTED FOR !llegal TINT. im legal are you?

Good points, I think it's much more dangerous to install NOS and superchargers especially when the people getting them installed are obviously going to haul ass everywhere.

Ever hear of a waiver? You seem like you certainly are aware of the tint laws in your area. Should a customer request darker tint than lawfull, put them on the line. I am sure you are have enough experience to "put the ball in the their court" when it comes to such violations. When you walk into court with a document outlining that the purchaser was aware of the current tinting laws and they opted to disregard the warnings, you are covered. In addition, always remember, 95% of us are law abiding individuals with nothing to hide, however law enforcement personnel do not know this when approaching you for the first time. Sure there are some cowboys out there, but the vast majority of law enforcement are just like you and me, just trying to make a living, not wanting to get shot, and certainly reasonable. Good luck with that.

Waivers only prove that you do !llegal work. They will actually work against you and you will be fined for installing !llegal tint.

BULLSEYE!

You make some good points. (except for #4, its one hell of a fine (and possibly more) in most parts to remove a catalytic converter). Are you pissed off enough yet? Are ANY of you pissed off enough yet? Are you pissed off enough to get proactive and actually try and make some changes instead of p1ss1ng and moaning? For the past 15 or so years, I have heard ALOT of bitching about the tint laws, and their constitutionality, yet I have heard very few answers proposed. And the few people who have proposed any viable answers have been ridiculed into silence, or their efforts have been actively sabotaged.

There have been a few attempts at "organizing" trade organizations, only to be scoffed at and ridiculed for the effort by the very ones who bitch about the state of affairs we are in. Hopefully, you are not one of those types and will get proactive. NOTHING is going to change unless this industry changes. That means that those involved are going to have to change their mindset, and change their business practices. Unless this industry can come together in a united front, it's gonna get worse. There is too much divisiveness, too many folks look at others as competition, rather than fraternal brothers and sisters who are facing being legislated out of work.

As for whether or not its our responsibility to enforce these laws, you are right, it's not. It IS, however, our responsibility to obey those laws whether or not they are constitutional. And if it is !llegal to INSTALL film not in compliance (as it is in most states), then do not install !llegal film. If you insist on doing so, quit crying. Bitching about constitutional issues is a moot point, because thanx to our gov't, our constitution is a moot point.

TintPhantom, this is not directed at you, please dont take it so. It's directed at all of those out there that it applies to. If it doesn't apply to you, no harm no foul. If it does, take a good hard look at your seves and your business practices before you start in on how unfair the laws are. Continuing on our present course will only result in further legislation against this industry.

back to topic....

it is !llegal for a person to do dr*gs...
it is !llegal for a person to provide the dr*gs to the user. cops are trained and paid to stop crime at the source. stop the source, no more crime.

it is !llegal to have dark tint b/c it poses a threat to police officers on traffic stops. ect.. it is a safety hazard to everyone. although window tint may provide comfort and protection for the harmful sun, there are too many other issues that beat agaist the permission to having dark tint. cops arent the only ones that dont want it. how do u feel when ur at a red light with a monte carlo next to u with dark ass tint....well in new orleans, u wouldnt feel so safe...cajun can back me on that one. maybe its a different story in arkansas or kansas...its a different kind of....well im not getting in to that here but u can watch the news.

yea i agree that it should be the customers problem once they roll out the bay, not the tinters. but i dont see it getting to that point any time soon. all the other places that deal with NOS and all that other stuff talked about should be in the same boat as us, whether we are help liable or the customer only. which ever way, they shouldnt have a line btween us and the other guys.

Some of the original points lack merit. A stereo can be installed and used properly (within legal limits). A DVD player installed in front of the driver can be used responsibly (when the car is parked). A supercharger can be installed and used legally (driven on public highways, then fully used on the track).
I can't comment on the 4x4 lift, removing the cat, or NOS so these are perhaps good examples.

How can !llegal tint be used legally? Maybe if the windows were always down while driving? (CA is anything behind the driver and 70 net in front)
If it is not our responsibility to enforce the tint laws, do we have a responsibility for the well-being of others? For public safety?

I have heard this BS arguement a thousand times and dude it just doesn't hold water. dr*gs are !llegal to use, possess, distribute ect. without the Government allowing it. We are TINTING WINDOWS the sale of the product is not regulated by the state or federal government. Its not !llegal to have dark tint in your possession. Its not !llegal to buy or sell.

Inhale air and get back on earth the TINT/Dr*g is apples/oranges

Its a morality issue nothing more. In NYS the only law on the books concerning window tint is the same traffic violation you get for driving with tinted glass $50 fine +$25 surcharge.

I am still waiting to hear someone with 1st hand knowledge of some receiving a summons for tinting windows

Pure and simple, people. DO WHAT YOU HAVE TO DO TO STAY IN BUSINESS. You have to live with your practices, and those who preach, are'nt always doing it on the up and up so much as they say. As the title reads, RESPONSIBILITY! You have to take responsibility for what you do, and don't have to answer to anyone. And those who would push their view or agenda, please remember the old adage: "Those who live in glass houses, should'nt throw stones......"

And to Rick,
Relax brother, that issue will probably still be there for the party who felt wronged for awhile, but will fade. It was an eye opener, not just in that issue, but in the issue of caution when dealing with those you do not know well enough (whether here, the whole internet, or wherever). If everyone learned something from it, that is good. You run a great site here, and need to have your rules and controls, but don't let it give you a heart attack!!!!

To CE:
It's done, my freind. Time to let it fade away. Everyone know the story and has made their opinions on it. You are doing good business, from your posts, and do not need to let this enter any part of your life. Your life lesson was aquired, use it to become a better businessman and tinter, and move forward!!!

MM: same advice I gave CE. At one point, I got involved in this issue, but realized that it was a waste of my time. I believe in Karma, and feel that if you do right, it comes back to you, and if you do wrong, it comes back 5 fold. Don't let it enter one more second of your life.

To others: no comment........


Back on subject, many states laws read that it is !llegal to operate a motor vehicle with windows tinted below that allowable by law. It is not !llegal to install. Therefore, in those states, the tinter is not breaking the law. The product is legal, only operating the vehicle with it on is not. Laws vary from state to state and blanket statements can be incorrect.


As far as an organization of tinters. We all know the idea was bandied about awhile back. Whether or not people scoffed, if thidea was more than a pipe dream, we should see something coming. The last statements I read on it, it was already on paper, with the major parties filing for non-profit status and so on. Ithink it was v4v or vclimber that posted it was still around. Hopefully we will see.

Those who live in the past, never have a future. Those who forget the past are condemmed to repeat it!!!!!

Right on, Johnny!!!!

those who remember the past can change the future. i think we're talking about !llegal equipment laws, not !llegal Dr*g laws. lets keep it on track dudes. once again, I AM FIGHTING THE INSTALLATION LAW! allredy ben to court, my trial date is set for 7-17-08

well here i am, ben summon to court for installing tint. dum a$$ law any way. i hope i have a good defence lawyer.

Please Clarify

You got a ticket for dark tint on your work truck OR you got a summons for install dark tint. Please give details What state? How did you get caught? Undercover Police car brought in for tint? Over the phone? Did you install the film or just say you would? Did they pay and come back?

If I remember this story correctly, He tinted his work vehicle(or it came tha way) too dark and got pulled over. Had his name on the truck and received a summons to court for it. Don't remember if it was for installing or having it on the truck. But, everyones advice at the time was to re-tint the truck legal, bring it and photos to court and ask for lenience. Now, I may be getting old, but this is what I remember. What say you, Tint Phantom???

custom t, is right, got a ticket for too dark and a summons for installing it.

Hopefully I am on track with this:
In many states it is not legal to operate a motor vehicle with a BAC above the legal limit. It is not against the law to serve alcohol. Therefore, the Bartender and the Tavern are not breaking the law. The product is legal, only being above the BAC is not legal.

This is what I saw when I read the original post by this person. We know that Taverns and Bartenders can be liable, I am guessing a tinter can be held liable as well, based on the way I read it ?
Am in in the ballpark on this, or totally off the mark ?

In certain states the tinter can be held liable, I was told by a sherrif in FL, to be careful because they are going to start cracking down on the tinter as well as the motorist, haven't seen or heard of it yet. Like Custom said, to each his own, you have to weigh out the monetary loss to the morality of abiding by the law, I try to talk people out of doing anything !llegal, but I also have a family to feed, we've all heard the argument on waivers, but thats what I use. Yes its an admission of guilt, noone will argue that, but it also shows, that I as a tinter advised the motorist of the law. I have a family to feed, and bills to pay just like everyone else and the !llegal jobs help me with that. I'm sure everyone here would like to do only legal installs, hell its easier anyway, dont need a droplight, shrink, cut, clean, peel, and stick, but that doesnt make the tintworld go 'round...

Your telling me you got 2 tickets 1 for operating a motor vechile with a total vlt lower than state law allows and a ticket for Installing window film darker than state allows.

It just doesnt make sence how did the cop know you installed he didnt see you do it




Ive been hearing BS like this since 1995 I still have yet to see a ticket, summons arrest or fine for installing film.

If you did get such a ticket could you post it? block out all private info of course but i would be interested in seeing what law was broken and the wording on the summons. what state.

Does anyone here know of a list, by state, of the laws regarding installation of !llegal window film?

In N.C. every police vehicle I install film on, I ask the officer and I get a different response every time, Most of them don't even know the laws about what is and isn't legal. One cop even stated " as long as the vehicle has two side mirrors, you can put whatever you want"

It happens all the time. Who knows anymore.

wouldn't the waiver protect you if you state the legal limits for hwy use and that by signing this waiver the customer is stating that this vehicle is for show/offroad use only.

Possibly in the same way as Dark visors on motorcycle helmets, in the UK it's !llegal to wear a dark/mirrored/iridium visor... however many wear them due to the impracticality of wearing sunglasses under your lid, on the same merit a visor can be popped up if you enter a dark tunnel or light levels drop, how safe is it to remove sunglasses in the same senario?? (BTW never been stopped for a Dark visor) Also is there a law under what light level drivers sunglasses must permit?? I don't think so, my driving sunglasses have 20% VLT so are these !llegal????

I was pulled over and given a window tint ticket. The ticket stated I had "dark" window tint, but no %. I went to a window tinting company and they tested it to be 39% and came on the car factory.
35% is legal in my area.

I disputed the $135 ticket. I never received a response back, so 2 months later I contacted the courthouse and they said they mixed me up with someone else and they sent all of my court papers to someone in another state. I then received the court papers and went to court, where I was asked to plead guilty or not guilty and I pled not guilty and got another court date. The next court date, I was asked again, "Do you plead guilty or not guilty," again I said not guilty and got another court date. The 3rd time I went to court, the judge was on vacation and the clerk said to come back in 3 days when he is back.
I go back 3 days later when requested and I get arrested for not seeing the judge when he is on vacation? They arrested me in the courthouse for "Failure to appear" and brought me to the police station. They said my bond was $135. I had $140, but they would not give me change, would not accept the extra $5, and took my money, so I had to stay overnight and "no call no show" to my work, because I wasn't allowed to use the phone. A friend brought the change for a twenty and I was released with yet another court date.
I goto this court date for the 4th time and I am asked "Do you plead guilty or not guilty, I respond "We already did this a few times, when can my side of the story be heard?" and the judge responds, "Don't question me, here is your new court date." So, I'm in court for the 5th time, and this time the prosecutor and officer is there. I was thinking finally, a resolution, but no. The prosecutor spoke her side of the story and when I presented 4 sworn & notarized affidavits from the window tinting company, he refuses to accept the documents and tells me he will only accept verbal testimony.
The judge then says I have 30 days to get a window tint prescription, but the doctor has to testify verbally. I then said "My tint is not illegal" He responds that he "does not want to hear %&$# come out of my mouth" and assigns again another court date where I must have verbal testimony from a doctor or I have to pay $890 in fines. Is this legal? I'm so confused and this is my first ticket I have ever had.

What state is that in?

Get a good lawyer....now.

Missouri. I was just passing through when this all started. Don't come here or you'll leave on probation if you ever get to leave!

None of the lawyers will get involved, because the judge knows every lawyer I contact.

I thought I had a right to an attorney, but the officer didn't say any rights when he arrested me and when I asked the judge, he said I have no rights and asked me "if I want a jury for $530".

Sounds fishy to me...

This just doesn't sound right, there has to be more to it than what we are being told.......

See his point in his issues.. I agree with all...

Why change industry.. change customers.. His point are valued.. If I have illegal stero.. do they go to the stereo shop no after the customer..Its true singled out...

But is there more to it.?. are you advertising tint on a company vehicle.... ? then it should be a fix it ticket iin most states...?????

There's not anymore to it. Its a small town.

The officer that gave me the ticket was driving a pickup truck with mud tires and was wearing a 3ft wide cow boy hat.

I'll find my info somewhere else.

I meant to do a reply to tint123.

Its a personal vehicle with factory window tint like normal not advertising anything. Its a Honda accord. Everyone in the area calls them "hon-dai's" It cant be a fix it ticket, because the tint is legal.
They refuse to test my window tint.