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Psst PPF explained, why you can't buy the prefect film yet.


Guest JYS

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In this topic I would like to share my humble experience of 12 years in PPF. Where I witnessed the rise and fall of many, and had a sneak peak on how they are made.

Ppf can be manufactured in two ways:

1- thermoplastic polyurethane (TPU)

This is usually the best way to make film. Where high melt heat extrusion of polyurethane occurs to make it in film form. And if not produced properly would go yellow after usage and uv exposure.

2- PVC films

Cheap, unreliable and have a slight blue haze on white cars and would chip and crack and burn.

Then an adhesive is applied to the film, and a top coat.

Your top coat is either:

Silicon based (washes away after a while)

Polymer based (used to mimic a fake self healing effect)

Or Floruide (cheap option to make a film glossy)

All perform under par and are the brands choice to reduce costs. At the end of the day most "brands" are after pushing film to you. And they mostly don't care if your customers have yellowing or other issues. After your top coat "washes away" uv start yellowing or burn your film. The harder the top coat is. The harder the film is to install. Usually good manufacturers "age" thier films a bit after production in dry-warm storage this allows adhesive to conform and topcoat to cure to the substrate (film).

All major film "brands" that you consider manufacturers in the Americas buy mostly from Agrotec. Which is a very capable and well established manufacturer. Most, not all, would be different in how they have different recipes for topcoats. Most contract it out to other companies or does the last bit in house.

The margins are very good, Polyurethane is usually sourced from companies such as sumitomo or sabic Innovative plastics (formally known as GE IP).

Most Asian manufacturers can source TPU cheaper than Agrotec but there is yet a company that had a success in maintaining a steady level of quality and consistency in film production. Some major brands started making films in Asia but after they import, slitt(cut) and package would label it as made in the USA. Some were successful in maintaining consistence quality.

I've been involved in developing hybrid film that uses no topcoat and gave more conform-able adhesives. Melted on high heat to insure yellowing is reduced and installs greatly in cold or hot weathers. I can't say that I've found the holy grail of all ppf. But I can tell you that it's not rocket since to make one. And everyone is too cheap or stuck in their cubicles to produce.

But soon, if one of these big boys started thinking about it, they would dominate the market if they employed the right amount of money to scale production up to make it an affordable great product.

On adhesive. Most resins and petroleum based adhesives are not an ideal choice. And when it comes to water based and acrylic adhesives, they are the best but the way the adhesive is applied to the film makes a huge difference when you install. And that why you get grab marks (silver marks) on some films with dark cars. And you might succeed in reducing the effect using a lubricant (slip solution) and some of the old installation technique charm.

Making ppf is a huge combination of technologies.

Rewind of the roll after production is also a factor. Where if not rewinded properly. You would get some tunnels in liner which might cause damage to the adhesive and lines or wedged to occur.

Cap sheets are used mainly for two reasons:

1- so a cheaper liner doesn't scuff the topcoat in the rewind process.

2- so film won't stick to it self when cut in a plotter.

Usually applied with a static silicon sheet to the film

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Eh, he's all over the place. He's inaccurate with some of his info and it's clear that he's building something else up that "he's" working on. A "hybrid" film. Take it for what it's worth. Also, he isn't in the US market which is different than the Middle East market so the conditions are different, money is different, coverage is different, and overall has different expectations. More than 50% of the cars out there are white. 

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Interesting comment PPFdistributing.

Can you please elaborate on what's inaccurate and how Middle East is not relevant. If anything it's exactly like a Lab accelerated weather testing. And I'm already into my second year in the US market.

Yes I'm working on something as I indicated, also I said I'm not close not a perfect film yet. But sure am doing better than doing nothing. :) its all about time mate. So I'm simply sharing the facts since knowing your products gets you better results than testing. And it's not because I'm trying to sell something.

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JYS,

I don't post too often on here. I'm installing more than reading and I pretty much stay out of the discussions that take place here. I enjoy this forum though and like to read it when I do get a chance. After seeing your post here I had to chime in.

You know enough to be dangerous. By that I mean you know enough to get some people on here possibly interested and excited in what your doing and possibly be able to create something that isn't a great product. Please continue your research and gain as much knowledge as possible to get the proper experience needed before you create something so that it is worth it and hopefully by then it will be an industry game changer that drives all others forward so I do wish you luck.

But...You are all over the place with your post above just like PPFdistributing said and I fully agree with him about inaccuracies.

I confirmed it by having some good friends look over your post who have extensive knowledge and years in polymers with R&D, lab experience, marketing what they create, etc...working for a multi-billion dollar global outfit who has brought alot of these technologies into the polymers industry world wide which we saw eventually trinkle down into the PPF arena. I also worked for this same company in the past.

Good job on using social media though to introduce yourself. I'll give you that. But you have no idea yet on how to take something to market and what it's going to take to get it there.

Word to the wise:

There's more than a few people on here that knows better so tread lightly.

Good luck to you though, I wish you the best.

~A

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PPF Distributing:

Thanks. Both Keith and Dave are welcomed. I'm looking forward for them to fly out from Kuwait/bahrain. It's always good to see old friends.

See ya at SEMA!

Alassing:

Thank you for your response and good wishes

I'm not mentioning my name, contact info, brands. Seriously I'm not trying to market or sell something. Neither looking for partners, very few know who is the guy behind the alias (actually only 2 members) and personally I know most of the guys here on the supply side, so if I was looking for and "introduction" I would pickup the phone and visit some of these guys.

I'm amazed at how much people are bought into brands currently in the market..

With all do respect to most of people with experiences in developing whatever is in the market, it's not very impressive, and I would like to talk to anyone who knows what it is to make a film A to Z first hand. Since I've been through it, from making TPU to the end. though I'm still learning but none of the companies I saw makes film all in house. I know what I'm talking about, if I did miss on a minor detail I stand to be corrected. I did make a product, but as I mentioned, is not market ready due to economies of scaling up and production. Plus, it is a very bad time to enter the global PPF market.

I wonder why you assume I can't or don't know what it takes to market and get a product out there. But we did kind of create the PPF market, demand and supply in our region. And we're one of the biggest single purchasers of film globally for 4 different "mega-brands" at different times and helped develop and test their products.

Since this is a forum to benefit the industry, please do explain on some of the issues where I were not accurate or wrong. It's just for the sake of being informative to the crowd so at least guys here can start buying film based on specs and testing for once instead of trial and error.

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After reading your post in the other forum I understand you are lacking in a lot of areas knowledge wise so I wont waste my time reading your post. As with the other two guys I would say you know enough to be dangerous... but your post to me looked like its a bunch of cut and paste edits... not your own thoughts. I have deployed over to the Middle East twice and have spent time in many of those countries and I have found those conditions there aren't much different than say Arizona. Well except the roads are terrible and the drivers are even worse.

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First, what other forum??? This is the only forum I read or write in.

Pro-tect. I'm aghast at your claim that this is copied or pasted.

I wrote this, and you can use a plagiarism checker to confirm it.

I'm sorry if this is a waste of time to you, it was optional to comment.

On weather, yes I don't disagree, nor with the driving.

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