Dirt off - Film on VS Baby shampoo

November 12, 2005

After trying johnsons baby shampoo I've never used anything else. Contamination dosen't occur from baby shampoo just from shoddy work.

[*]336024

:spit :lol2

blade · November 12, 2005

bunch of lllusers in this thread :spit

film-on = more money in the pockets of those who are already on a 'holier than thou' trip

tintinater · November 13, 2005

J&J is made for Babies hair
Joy is made for dirty dishes

Film-on is made for window film installs

I wouldnt use joy or film-on on my babies hair

I wouldnt use J&J or film-on on my dirty dishes

so on and so on

[*]336270

I agree , film on is the way to go . Baby shampoo has dyes and fragences added that are not good for the film and and adhesive. Use Film-On ! It's awesome!!!!

[*]336314

Blah, Blah, Blah, dirt-off, blah, blah, blah, film-on, blah, blah, blah....

Man, I've used that crap, it sucks, it's WAY over-rated, WAY over-priced, and it's just a marketing scheme you guys fell for....

Baby shampoo works fine, never had any, repeat: ANY, problems with plain old j&j baby shampoo. I remember when that crap came out the Lu Lu rep gave us some free dirt-off/film-on to try out. We were not impressed.....

P.S. Come on, "know-it-alls", tell me why I'm wrong, give me all your technical jargon and stats......

November 13, 2005

J&J is safe your baby, film-on is not. So....why keep your hands soaking up film-on all day? I know some of you have always used J&J and most if not all film company's aprove of its use as well as joy or dawn. :dunno

November 13, 2005

j & j all the way. never had a problem with it.

November 13, 2005

bunch of lllusers in this thread?? ?
film-on = more money in the pockets of those who are already on a 'holier than thou' trip

[*]336373

Actually it is sold at cost... the money they make comes from film sales, which is used to build more space at their business, to add new machines and technology, to keep pace with demand. Business 103... :dunno

J&J is made for Babies hair
Joy is made for dirty dishes

Film-on is made for window film installs

I wouldnt use joy or film-on on my babies hair

I wouldnt use J&J or film-on on my dirty dishes

so on and so on

[*]336270

I agree , film on is the way to go . Baby shampoo has dyes and fragences added that are not good for the film and and adhesive. Use Film-On ! It's awesome!!!!

[*]336314

Blah, Blah, Blah, dirt-off, blah, blah, blah, film-on, blah, blah, blah....

Man, I've used that crap, it sucks, it's WAY over-rated, WAY over-priced, and it's just a marketing scheme you guys fell for....

Baby shampoo works fine, never had any, repeat: ANY, problems with plain old j&j baby shampoo. I remember when that crap came out the Lu Lu rep gave us some free dirt-off/film-on to try out. We were not impressed.....

P.S. Come on, "know-it-alls", tell me why I'm wrong, give me all your technical jargon and stats......

[*]336479

Yep... I can see where they got no where...

I reality... FO and DO were developed in response to the level of film adhesive failures the industry was experiencing at the time and not just LLu, all of them... When Courtaulds bought out Martin Processing, Insulfilm and US Lamco, they researched the whole idea of film failure and came away with the conclusion that some soap chemistries were not the best to mix with the chemistry of film adhesives.

No I'm by no means a know-it-all, but I do keep an open-minded approach to many things these days, especially those I know little about (like chemistry). So when a chemist tells me this or that is not good for the adhesive, I tend to listen. So did many other tinters since the inception of FO and DO concept of installing. The result was a serious plummet in warranty claims for adhesive failure.

The other factor in the equation was the amount of water being left under the film at install. Couple that with a soap that does not bode well with the adhesive chemistry and you get film failure and claims.

Me, I'd prefer to redo as little of my own installs as possible so I listen to those who make the product I install, not some old timer who's been doing the same thing for 30 years and has never opened their mind to the wonders of the film industry outside the confines of their shop or city in which it is located. But that's just me...

It's understandable that someone like, say, Blade for instance, would say they've not had any come backs that can be attributed to adhesive failure from the soap he uses... he's in a mild NW US climate. On the other hand, in Florida where I did most of my installing over the years and experienced more than my share of adhesive craze redo's, it makes since to see that there may be something amiss in the install equation.

I was using FO and DO in Naples when they first hit the scene... wasn't fun at first, but I was willing to do my part in ridding myself of as many adhesive failed installs I could. Over time my installation skills were refined to the point of being able to install with FO in mid-summer with less than 10 pumps (double what the bottle recommends).

I've said it before... the only thing that keeps the industry from changing for the better is arrogance.

Use what you wish, but if the adhesive fails and the warranty claim numbers fall out of the norm, the way one installs will be scrutinized first. Just the way it is for one film maker.

:lol2 Rant...

TintWizard · November 13, 2005

I'm probably the only one that does this here but I found for myself that I use a 4 bottle system.

1. Dirt - Off to clean windows with

2. Film - Off to apply film with

3 . Palmolive dish detergent mixture to squeeqee film once applied

4. Water for final squeegee to get rid of soap residue

Benifets from my perspective :

The mild acid breaks up residue that you can't even see with the Dirt Off

You get the proper "bond" minus the extra added chemicles that can be found in detergents with Film ON

**This is the important part for me:**

The Palmolive misture is great because it's mixed at a different "slip ratio" than that of the Film on which means I can squeegee hard first time without the film sliding with the benifets of using only 1/2 the Film On ..why pay for using it through the whole process when the only time it is REALLY needed I underneath the film .

My hands no longer get "rough " thanks to using palmolive 1/2 the time instead of using Film On all the time .

Not THE way ...only A way :dunno

November 13, 2005

I'm probably the only one that does this here but I found for myself that I use a 4 bottle system.
1. Dirt - Off to clean windows with

2. Film - Off to apply film with

3 . Palmolive dish detergent mixture to squeeqee film once applied

4. Water for final squeegee to get rid of soap residue

Benifets from my perspective :

The mild acid breaks up residue that you can't even see with the Dirt Off

You get the proper "bond" minus the extra added chemicles that can be found in detergents with Film ON

**This is the important part for me:**

The Palmolive misture is great because it's mixed at a different "slip ratio" than that of the Film on which means I can squeegee hard first time without the film sliding with the benifets of using only 1/2 the Film On ..why pay for using it through the whole process when the only time it is REALLY needed I underneath the film .

My hands no longer get "rough " thanks to using palmolive 1/2 the time instead of using Film On all the time .

Not THE way ...only A way

[*]336510