Supreme

I would definitely like to chime into this before the Installer bashing goes to far, seeing as though I am the installer in question!
 
When customers contact installers with absolutely no idea on a product It is their job to educate as much as possible. This is usually appreciated as it is a big unknown area and a lot of trades do not put enough effort into, they are in it just to get your money (as you so put it).
 
This is a perfect example of words being taken out of context by the customer focusing on the word 'major' and not understanding on what an installer of a particular product considers to be major. This was elaborated on but clearly not enough. I 100% standby that not every install can be completely flawless/perfect. Im sure if trained installers looked those that claim there's are they will find minute flaws in some of their installs. Sure these are flaws that 99% of customers will never notice and are hard to see but if you happen to get that customer that does go looking and notice it, then its better to set expectations before. Cars come in that are 'brand new' in the customers eyes that can have defects, rock chips they never noticed that may result in a slight air bubble, the odd spec of dust etc.  Yes also slightly cautious over potential Opticoat issues recesses, stretched areas etc but due to many forums claiming they have not had an issue we were more than happy to set this out from the start and continue if wanted. Straight from Xpels FAQ page
"Can/should Opticoat or cQuartz be applied to the car before the film is installed?"
We do NOT recommend applying sealants such as Opticoat or cQuartz to the parts of the car that will be covered with film. The low surface energy of paint sealant products such as these will cause adhesion problems both during installation and over the life of the product. In addition, it is worth noting that there is really no benefit to applying sealant to the paint before the film anyway, since the film will provide far more environmental protection to the paint than a sealant ever could.
 
As mentioned, its about ensuring there is nothing visually displeasing, of course fingerprints, silvering etc are unacceptable. Every installer knows that you don't last long in this (and many other) business doing bad installs and I certain wouldn't offer a service that I lose money on from not being able to install properly.  We have never had an issue with an unhappy customer and they appreciate us being upfront about PPF not being completely invisible. This is impressed on you during the XPEL certification to not sell the PPF as a completely invisible and indestructible product. They in fact mentioned they shoot for 95% perfect installs, does this mean they 5% is a dirty big line or air bubbles everywhere. No, it means they are realistic that not every install can be 100% and you could waste a lot of money chasing that 100% unnecessarily.
 
I advised the customer that they definitely need to check out an install and happy for them to come by this Friday to check out a full frontal we are doing, as seeing the product that they have never seen and discussing in person is invaluable to emails. Unfortunately that time didn't work out which was fine but still would have thought a lot better then taking to a forum.
 
I would also like to add that I had already checked DAP and there were no kits for an Audi S1, was 99% sure this meant we were not going to do it but was always happy to confirm. I took time to provide advice knowing this rather then saying, sorry, no kit available, see you later. Was only too happy to try assist knowing it will help our towns only other installer (who we have good rapport with that uses Hexis Bodyfence). Was also asked if I wrap edges, took the time to educate about what is wrap able and what isnt
 
Apologies if the word 'major' was taken out of context, would have been happy to clarify more or as mentioned show you if you were concerned but yes I did as DynamicApearance mentioned sense pickiness, more through a lack of exposure to the product and from you reading forums but I was only too happy to assist with all that as there is nothing wrong with pickiness.
Removal and coatings over films were not even discussed, so I don't need contacting/educating over that thanks Jeff.
 
Day 1 back off holiday, hopefully this doesn't set the tone for the rest of the year.
 
Good luck with your install.

I switched from Xpel to Suntek and i like it. I did go from XPEL Ultimate to Suntek Ultra though so maybe a bit of apples and oranges as i never tried the Ultimate +. As mentioned above there is a lot that comes into play with choosing who to go with. Software pricing and CS are big. I know XPEL in the US are great and loved dealing with the guys there. Was a different story over hear though, i wont go into it too much but it was more about selling film so setting up installers as direct competition in the area wasnt a concern instead of growing current installers business. In the US i believe you dont have that issue as country distributors are more concerned with the bottom dollar since they have an investment riding on it.
 
As far as the software goes, Truecut has come leaps and bounds. I am very impressed with the newer patterns and its getting easier to use. Not as easy as i found DAP but for the price i dont mind taking some extra time to tinker and i expect it to get easier over time. Suntek have also teamed up with creaform3d to implement new 3D scanning technology. the machine used looks pretty wicked and if they say it will be even more accurate then thats exciting. Bottom line is they are constantly trying to improve all aspects so i have no issues sticking with Truecut. 

May depend where he is located. I know some of the distributors here for brands new to the market (new here anyway) only offer 60" rolls e.g Stek & Avery.  They are obviously distributors that arent too aware of the needs of the installer or are just offering a limited range until they can gauge its popularity.

cmon man, dont make it so tempting to make a comment about being a father or banging a relative 
 
 

Sorry but it came across as sour grapes with comments that weren't needed, nothing to do with me being sensitive. Maybe reread your first too unnecessary lines instead of blaming others for why you don't post.
 
So bottom line is guys, Suntek announced 72" rolls are on their way. Others apparently haven't them to but 3 months is too early to start marketing. Enjoy them from whoever you get them from but apparently they will have issue.
 
Enjoy your installs, I'm off to get a coffee.

Shots fired against Suntek hey, not sure why. Well they did market it at SEMA and they also did installs of it I believe, which one could assume wouldn't be done if there was quality issues.
 
No one ever said it was exclusive, just that they are first to announce its release as it is a much anticipated size for some. If Premiumshield has quality issues with their 72" rolls then that's their issue, and if you are not expecting much from it then why would you release it, don't release it at all until you are certain the quality is high. I wouldn't be comparing the sub par quality of Ventureshield to the better quality and more forgiving films of today.
 
 

Shots fired against Suntek hey, not sure why. Well they did market it at SEMA and they also did installs of it I believe, which one could assume wouldn't be done if there was quality issues.
 
No one ever said it was exclusive, just that they are first to announce its release as it is a much anticipated size for some. If Premiumshield has quality issues with their 72" rolls then that's their issue, and if you are not expecting much from it then why would you release it, don't release it at all until you are certain the quality is high. I wouldn't be comparing the sub par quality of Ventureshield to the better quality and more forgiving films of today.
 
 

I don't think anyone should get on Dynamics case for trying, the challenge was thrown out there and like he said no one is really going to fly there to accept it so nothing wrong with him attempting it over pics.
 
I don't think (would hope) there is one installer that wouldn't aim for those standards. You do have to draw the line somewhere if that perfection means unnecessary material and time wastage for not much gain. Sure learn from it for the next install. There are shops that don't get high discounts on material to waste, have high overheads, single or low staff numbers, better eyes, lighting etc. Knowing when to cut your acceptable losses is just as an important part to a successful business, as long as the customer is happy....

I don't think anyone should get on Dynamics case for trying, the challenge was thrown out there and like he said no one is really going to fly there to accept it so nothing wrong with him attempting it over pics.
 
I don't think (would hope) there is one installer that wouldn't aim for those standards. You do have to draw the line somewhere if that perfection means unnecessary material and time wastage for not much gain. Sure learn from it for the next install. There are shops that don't get high discounts on material to waste, have high overheads, single or low staff numbers, better eyes, lighting etc. Knowing when to cut your acceptable losses is just as an important part to a successful business, as long as the customer is happy....

I would definitely like to chime into this before the Installer bashing goes to far, seeing as though I am the installer in question!
 
When customers contact installers with absolutely no idea on a product It is their job to educate as much as possible. This is usually appreciated as it is a big unknown area and a lot of trades do not put enough effort into, they are in it just to get your money (as you so put it).
 
This is a perfect example of words being taken out of context by the customer focusing on the word 'major' and not understanding on what an installer of a particular product considers to be major. This was elaborated on but clearly not enough. I 100% standby that not every install can be completely flawless/perfect. Im sure if trained installers looked those that claim there's are they will find minute flaws in some of their installs. Sure these are flaws that 99% of customers will never notice and are hard to see but if you happen to get that customer that does go looking and notice it, then its better to set expectations before. Cars come in that are 'brand new' in the customers eyes that can have defects, rock chips they never noticed that may result in a slight air bubble, the odd spec of dust etc.  Yes also slightly cautious over potential Opticoat issues recesses, stretched areas etc but due to many forums claiming they have not had an issue we were more than happy to set this out from the start and continue if wanted. Straight from Xpels FAQ page
"Can/should Opticoat or cQuartz be applied to the car before the film is installed?"
We do NOT recommend applying sealants such as Opticoat or cQuartz to the parts of the car that will be covered with film. The low surface energy of paint sealant products such as these will cause adhesion problems both during installation and over the life of the product. In addition, it is worth noting that there is really no benefit to applying sealant to the paint before the film anyway, since the film will provide far more environmental protection to the paint than a sealant ever could.
 
As mentioned, its about ensuring there is nothing visually displeasing, of course fingerprints, silvering etc are unacceptable. Every installer knows that you don't last long in this (and many other) business doing bad installs and I certain wouldn't offer a service that I lose money on from not being able to install properly.  We have never had an issue with an unhappy customer and they appreciate us being upfront about PPF not being completely invisible. This is impressed on you during the XPEL certification to not sell the PPF as a completely invisible and indestructible product. They in fact mentioned they shoot for 95% perfect installs, does this mean they 5% is a dirty big line or air bubbles everywhere. No, it means they are realistic that not every install can be 100% and you could waste a lot of money chasing that 100% unnecessarily.
 
I advised the customer that they definitely need to check out an install and happy for them to come by this Friday to check out a full frontal we are doing, as seeing the product that they have never seen and discussing in person is invaluable to emails. Unfortunately that time didn't work out which was fine but still would have thought a lot better then taking to a forum.
 
I would also like to add that I had already checked DAP and there were no kits for an Audi S1, was 99% sure this meant we were not going to do it but was always happy to confirm. I took time to provide advice knowing this rather then saying, sorry, no kit available, see you later. Was only too happy to try assist knowing it will help our towns only other installer (who we have good rapport with that uses Hexis Bodyfence). Was also asked if I wrap edges, took the time to educate about what is wrap able and what isnt
 
Apologies if the word 'major' was taken out of context, would have been happy to clarify more or as mentioned show you if you were concerned but yes I did as DynamicApearance mentioned sense pickiness, more through a lack of exposure to the product and from you reading forums but I was only too happy to assist with all that as there is nothing wrong with pickiness.
Removal and coatings over films were not even discussed, so I don't need contacting/educating over that thanks Jeff.
 
Day 1 back off holiday, hopefully this doesn't set the tone for the rest of the year.
 
Good luck with your install.

I would definitely like to chime into this before the Installer bashing goes to far, seeing as though I am the installer in question!
 
When customers contact installers with absolutely no idea on a product It is their job to educate as much as possible. This is usually appreciated as it is a big unknown area and a lot of trades do not put enough effort into, they are in it just to get your money (as you so put it).
 
This is a perfect example of words being taken out of context by the customer focusing on the word 'major' and not understanding on what an installer of a particular product considers to be major. This was elaborated on but clearly not enough. I 100% standby that not every install can be completely flawless/perfect. Im sure if trained installers looked those that claim there's are they will find minute flaws in some of their installs. Sure these are flaws that 99% of customers will never notice and are hard to see but if you happen to get that customer that does go looking and notice it, then its better to set expectations before. Cars come in that are 'brand new' in the customers eyes that can have defects, rock chips they never noticed that may result in a slight air bubble, the odd spec of dust etc.  Yes also slightly cautious over potential Opticoat issues recesses, stretched areas etc but due to many forums claiming they have not had an issue we were more than happy to set this out from the start and continue if wanted. Straight from Xpels FAQ page
"Can/should Opticoat or cQuartz be applied to the car before the film is installed?"
We do NOT recommend applying sealants such as Opticoat or cQuartz to the parts of the car that will be covered with film. The low surface energy of paint sealant products such as these will cause adhesion problems both during installation and over the life of the product. In addition, it is worth noting that there is really no benefit to applying sealant to the paint before the film anyway, since the film will provide far more environmental protection to the paint than a sealant ever could.
 
As mentioned, its about ensuring there is nothing visually displeasing, of course fingerprints, silvering etc are unacceptable. Every installer knows that you don't last long in this (and many other) business doing bad installs and I certain wouldn't offer a service that I lose money on from not being able to install properly.  We have never had an issue with an unhappy customer and they appreciate us being upfront about PPF not being completely invisible. This is impressed on you during the XPEL certification to not sell the PPF as a completely invisible and indestructible product. They in fact mentioned they shoot for 95% perfect installs, does this mean they 5% is a dirty big line or air bubbles everywhere. No, it means they are realistic that not every install can be 100% and you could waste a lot of money chasing that 100% unnecessarily.
 
I advised the customer that they definitely need to check out an install and happy for them to come by this Friday to check out a full frontal we are doing, as seeing the product that they have never seen and discussing in person is invaluable to emails. Unfortunately that time didn't work out which was fine but still would have thought a lot better then taking to a forum.
 
I would also like to add that I had already checked DAP and there were no kits for an Audi S1, was 99% sure this meant we were not going to do it but was always happy to confirm. I took time to provide advice knowing this rather then saying, sorry, no kit available, see you later. Was only too happy to try assist knowing it will help our towns only other installer (who we have good rapport with that uses Hexis Bodyfence). Was also asked if I wrap edges, took the time to educate about what is wrap able and what isnt
 
Apologies if the word 'major' was taken out of context, would have been happy to clarify more or as mentioned show you if you were concerned but yes I did as DynamicApearance mentioned sense pickiness, more through a lack of exposure to the product and from you reading forums but I was only too happy to assist with all that as there is nothing wrong with pickiness.
Removal and coatings over films were not even discussed, so I don't need contacting/educating over that thanks Jeff.
 
Day 1 back off holiday, hopefully this doesn't set the tone for the rest of the year.
 
Good luck with your install.