Suntek Ultra Vision 40 failure

vquestfilms.com · December 4, 2014

I talked with Debbie at the Suntek southwest office on my last order of Ultra Vision about X100. She read through the specs on the film, and X100, and got back to me with saying not to use it on that particular film.

This was her reply to me yesterday. I always get what they say in writing because it seems to change.

our UltraVision is made with non-corrosive metals, so X-100 is fine.

Could be scale... High pH (X-100 is higher in pH than soap) and high alkaline water can do that... Water with a high alkalinity is more likely to be scale-forming even at a relatively low pH.

You might want to consider the water that you used. :twocents

Corrosion and oxidation tend not to be restricted to the shape of water bubbles, they usually migrate outward losing a discernible shape. Usually...

3MFAN · December 4, 2014

I talked with Debbie at the Suntek southwest office on my last order of Ultra Vision about X100. She read through the specs on the film, and X100, and got back to me with saying not to use it on that particular film.
This was her reply to me yesterday. I always get what they say in writing because it seems to change.
our UltraVision is made with non-corrosive metals, so X-100 is fine.

Could be scale... High pH (X-100 is higher in pH than soap) and high alkaline water can do that... Water with a high alkalinity is more likely to be scale-forming even at a relatively low pH.

You might want to consider the water that you used.

Corrosion and oxidation tend not to be restricted to the shape of water bubbles, they usually migrate outward losing a discernible shape. Usually...

might be a possibility but used the same source for 8 yrs and I would think other films would also fail.

vquestfilms.com · December 4, 2014

I talked with Debbie at the Suntek southwest office on my last order of Ultra Vision about X100. She read through the specs on the film, and X100, and got back to me with saying not to use it on that particular film.
This was her reply to me yesterday. I always get what they say in writing because it seems to change.
our UltraVision is made with non-corrosive metals, so X-100 is fine.

Could be scale... High pH (X-100 is higher in pH than soap) and high alkaline water can do that... Water with a high alkalinity is more likely to be scale-forming even at a relatively low pH.

You might want to consider the water that you used.

Corrosion and oxidation tend not to be restricted to the shape of water bubbles, they usually migrate outward losing a discernible shape. Usually...

might be a possibility but used the same source for 8 yrs and I would think other films would also fail.

True, but your pic has a lot of identifying marks of scale. Some homes have the issue in the pipes, the installer uses the tap water from the house and thus the problem finds its way under the film. It has the possibility of being a unique situation.

I'm too buried to read through 3 pages... was it just 1 pane or was it the whole job?

3MFAN · December 4, 2014

It was the whole job twice along with another job inbetween. When I fill bottles at shop it is hard water. Most likely at houses it is soft. The water at this house would have been used at next job also without issues.

vquestfilms.com · December 4, 2014

It was the whole job twice along with another job inbetween. When I fill bottles at shop it is hard water. Most likely at houses it is soft. The water at this house would have been used at next job also without issues.

Scaling tends to be the result of water with a high hardness. Hard water typically contains a lot of calcium compounds which can precipitate out as calcium carbonate. High pH as in X-100 just escalates this issue. Even when the pH is low, water with a high alkalinity is more likely to be scale-forming.

Water composition (not just quality as in debris-free) is a big issue, I'm surprised we do not get more direction from the MFG's about it. :hmmm

3MFAN · December 5, 2014

It was the whole job twice along with another job inbetween. When I fill bottles at shop it is hard water. Most likely at houses it is soft. The water at this house would have been used at next job also without issues.

Scaling tends to be the result of water with a high hardness. Hard water typically contains a lot of calcium compounds which can precipitate out as calcium carbonate. High pH as in X-100 just escalates this issue. Even when the pH is low, water with a high alkalinity is more likely to be scale-forming.

Water composition (not just quality as in debris-free) is a big issue, I'm surprised we do not get more direction from the MFG's about it.

You would think I would have a regular problem and with other films. I have been using the hard water for at least 8 years now. And the more taht I think about it on the 1st job 1 window faced east and that one was ok. The others all were south on both jobs.

vquestfilms.com · December 5, 2014

It was the whole job twice along with another job inbetween. When I fill bottles at shop it is hard water. Most likely at houses it is soft. The water at this house would have been used at next job also without issues.

Scaling tends to be the result of water with a high hardness. Hard water typically contains a lot of calcium compounds which can precipitate out as calcium carbonate. High pH as in X-100 just escalates this issue. Even when the pH is low, water with a high alkalinity is more likely to be scale-forming.

Water composition (not just quality as in debris-free) is a big issue, I'm surprised we do not get more direction from the MFG's about it.

You would think I would have a regular problem and with other films. I have been using the hard water for at least 8 years now. And the more taht I think about it on the 1st job 1 window faced east and that one was ok. The others all were south on both jobs.

Yeah, one would think it would be a regular issue for you. :dunno All I can say is that it has hallmarks of scale that gets left in excess water deposits on drying film. It could be something else but I'm not seeing what that is without dissecting the film.

I see dealers having mineral deposit issues from time to time with lighter VLT films like 70% and up. I've always encouraged the use of de-ionized water when installing the high VLT sputtered films because they can show refraction from mineral deposits. I used to install in an area with high mineral content in the water and I would see stuff like this when installers left water behind under the film. Bronze used to be the worst and then if you ignored all direction and used X-100 on bronze it was really bad.