Expel Ultimate or wait for Nano?

August 29, 2011

Off the wall question for those installing PPF.... Have any of you used the PPF LLumar has? Maybe it'd the same stuff as Xpel, Venture Shield? Just curious...
I've looked at offering it to my customers... Got trained, etc... But have not gotten into the PPF much, YET!!!

I have it on my car, not super impressed. It was fairly easy to work with but the color and texture wasn't there. I think the Nano sample spoiled me though and I have been comparing all of the subsequent films to the Nano. The 2 things that I didn't like were it was a bit yellow on my white car and after it was installed, the film was very rubbery feeling, almost tacky to it seemed to grab dust. I put some wax on it and that helped a bit.

Cool... I was interested to know since I have no experience with other PPF... And have seen lots use Xpel...., etc.

August 29, 2011

Off the wall question for those installing PPF.... Have any of you used the PPF LLumar has? Maybe it'd the same stuff as Xpel, Venture Shield? Just curious...
I've looked at offering it to my customers... Got trained, etc... But have not gotten into the PPF much, YET!!!

I have it on my car, not super impressed. It was fairly easy to work with but the color and texture wasn't there. I think the Nano sample spoiled me though and I have been comparing all of the subsequent films to the Nano. The 2 things that I didn't like were it was a bit yellow on my white car and after it was installed, the film was very rubbery feeling, almost tacky to it seemed to grab dust. I put some wax on it and that helped a bit.

If you thought the Llumar was yellow right after putting it on the car, wait 6 months. I've had to re-do about 5 customer jobs from 6-8 months ago that I did Llumar on. I was trying different films on the market, & while Llumar was really nice to work with, it does not hold up at ALL.

Oh yea, & you are totally HOSED on the warranty. Here, you can have more of the Llumar film on credit, with NO Labor compensation. Lesson learned.

August 29, 2011

As far as the test above...

No, that wasn't really a good real-world test.

Use the sharpie, & let it sit. THEN, wipe both samples as they sit there with a dry microfiber towel. The Avery might clean off & you are done. Otherwise, 91% is too hot a solution. It damages the finish on both the films, ruining any potential results you may be going after. I'd either water the 90% down to 50/50 with water, or get some 70% to use. That will be much more forgiving on the films.

The chrome inside a headlight is not a porous urethane material, so the 90% alcohol is not going to harm it like it will the films.

I've taken a fresh egg, cracked it open & smeared some on the Nano film, & let it dry. This would KILL car paint, but on the nano, it left a ghost where the egg was. The next day, the ghost was gone, & you could not tell it was there at all.

Nano rocks.

The ///Man · August 29, 2011

I also went to the shop and the installer let me watch one of his installs, so I could see the quality of his work. He does amazing work mostly cars 4-7 times the price of my Acura TL, and I did not negotiate the price thats his going rate.

So why not trust his judgement, give him his price, tip him $50 for a nice dinner and be done with it? Either film is going to be good, pay the guy, appreciate his work, send him more business. It's a pretty simple solution to a pretty simple problem. You don't want rock chips, he sells a service that helps prevent rock chips. Sounds pretty darn easy.

August 30, 2011

I also went to the shop and the installer let me watch one of his installs, so I could see the quality of his work. He does amazing work mostly cars 4-7 times the price of my Acura TL, and I did not negotiate the price thats his going rate.

So why not trust his judgement, give him his price, tip him $50 for a nice dinner and be done with it? Either film is going to be good, pay the guy, appreciate his work, send him more business. It's a pretty simple solution to a pretty simple problem. You don't want rock chips, he sells a service that helps prevent rock chips. Sounds pretty darn easy.

I would be more then happy to if he could get the nano in. Just picked up my car up today, nano eta unknown. The point of my thread was to get feedback on expel as a possible substitute, not to negotiate pricing. I would never negotiate with someones livelihood at stake like that.

Seriously though could you just stop talking? Every post you make is condescending and arrogance, but with a screen name like "The /// Man" I cant say i'm very surprised.

duggyb · August 30, 2011

I also went to the shop and the installer let me watch one of his installs, so I could see the quality of his work. He does amazing work mostly cars 4-7 times the price of my Acura TL, and I did not negotiate the price thats his going rate.

So why not trust his judgement, give him his price, tip him $50 for a nice dinner and be done with it? Either film is going to be good, pay the guy, appreciate his work, send him more business. It's a pretty simple solution to a pretty simple problem. You don't want rock chips, he sells a service that helps prevent rock chips. Sounds pretty darn easy.

I would be more then happy to if he could get the nano in. Just picked up my car up today, nano eta unknown. The point of my thread was to get feedback on expel as a possible substitute, not to negotiate pricing. I would never negotiate with someones livelihood at stake like that.

Seriously though could you just stop talking? Every post you make is condescending and arrogance, but with a screen name like "The /// Man" I cant say i'm very surprised.

First off PLEASE spell Xpel correct from now on, that just bothers me.

Second, i understand where you are coming from Roger, i am a simliar type of person in the sense i research as much as i can to make an educated decision on the BEST product at the time, and i usually stick with it for awhile.

For example i just went through this when i had to buy a new phone, it was between the new Samsung Galaxy S2 or a HTC Sensation, both were great phones and did more than i needed, one was also $200 more in this case, and i had to make a decision, with the Samsung being more, but newer and a much better phone i decided to make the call to wait it out(this was about 4 mths ago) and get the better phone, the downside is i had to stick with my crappy old Blackberry Curve on a crappy Telus plan for another 4-5 months.

The point i am trying to make is the Xpel Ultimate and Avery Nano are both top notch films, the best two on the market i would say, and both are going to accomplish the same task, which is protect from rock chips. Will one last longer? maybe so but i wouldn't say so. Is one a better film because of a few aspects? id say Nano is yes. That doesn't mean Xpel wont get it done.

SO either wait it out and get a few more stone chips on the front end or don't drive the Acura and suffer like i did with my phone to wait out the better product, OR get the Xpel, get protected and be happy you no longer will get chips and had a top notch installer do it.

I also like The Mans comment about tipping, sounds stupid in this industry, that super duty i posted here the guy tipped me $10 because he was happy with what he received for his $$( I use 3M film BTW). Now is that $10 much, not at all,especially compared to what he paid for the install, the point is he thought it was worth it, now he is booked back in for more work and i have given him more than a $10 anyways because he came back to me. It all goes around.

You have two options, just decide. Case Closed.

Thanks.

Dustin

August 30, 2011

Thanks Dustin, I agree both films would probably be fine, and if the Xpel Ultimate had been out a bit longer with some more feedback I wouldn't be as hesitant to just slap it on. I've decided to just wait on the nano for at least another week or so, I wont be driving the car so no chips. Hopefully it doesn't take too long, does anyone know if Avery is actually running production on the nano right now or have QC issues caused them to stop production for the time being?

August 31, 2011

Just FYI, if you really want to test how well the film can be cleaned, and not haze the clear coat in the process, it would be better to use the right product. Alcohol is a solvent, and therefore will remove most stains, but because Ultimate has an automotive clear coat on it, alcohol is not the best product for the test. Use an automotive bug and tar remover instead. Xylene based products such as this work better with the chemistry of the clear coat and won't cause any damage. It will also take off anything you get on it. It's kinda like how you could use battery acid on your car's clear coat to get a bug stain off, but it wouldn't matter much because you would destroy the paint in the process ;)

Hope this helps.

August 31, 2011

Double post, sorry.

August 31, 2011

Just FYI, if you really want to test how well the film can be cleaned, and not haze the clear coat in the process, it would be better to use the right product. Alcohol is a solvent, and therefore will remove most stains, but because Ultimate has an automotive clear coat on it, alcohol is not the best product for the test. Use an automotive bug and tar remover instead. Xylene based products such as this work better with the chemistry of the clear coat and won't cause any damage. It will also take off anything you get on it. It's kinda like how you could use battery acid on your car's clear coat to get a bug stain off, but it wouldn't matter much because you would destroy the paint in the process ;)
Hope this helps.

I'll do a few more tests with some different cleaners to see how it reacts. I think its a bit misleading to say the Xpel uses automotive clear, real automotive clear that has been cured with a catalyst does not react to most solvents especially not Isopropyl. However Isopropyl will spear a clearcoat finish applied with a rattle can!