My windows are now.... very, very hot!

TINT · June 28, 2005

external films carry a lower quality and lower warranty coverage.

blade · June 28, 2005

and a MUCH higher chance of contamination

June 28, 2005

If you want the maximum heat protection and you have doubleglazed units you definitely should get an external film. I can't believe it took so many replies until you have the only answer to that question.

[*]294278

I agree with you. I can't believe that this is the first mention of external films. I've been to Madico and other's websites and not seen anything that discusses external films. Did I just miss it?

I'd love to see the specs on some external film.

Still have a house to build in the near term future!

Thanks

George

[*]294296

Exterior film comes in limited availability such as silver reflective and carry 10 year warranty on vertically installed glass.

June 30, 2005

I know there have been alot of topics brought up in this thread. There are several things that have not been brought up which are important. I realize you have already tinted your windows in your existing home, but since you are here for info for your new home, if you don't mind, I'd like to offer some more specific film information. Much of what has been said on here is flaming and trashing about diy install and film quality. Little has been said about the real differences between film types and qualities, importance of warranties etc.

Let's start with warranties. In your new home, you will most likely be putting in new glass. This glass will come with a lifetime warranty against seal failure and glass breakage, yes? It should if it is the least bit decent that is. If you read the fine print on your glass warranty, you will discover that all seal failure and glass breakage coverage will be gone the instant you apply film to your glass. Now, when you purchase gila film or any other diy film, you will be purchasing film only, you will not be purchasing installation, film warranty or glass warranty. BUT with a professional install you will be getting all three.

Now as to the importance of a glass warranty. As I've read your posts, I see you have already experienced seal failure. Did you know that can happen on very new glass? Also another thing that can happen is glass breakage. This occurs from thermal stress. Any type of film can cause glass breakage on a defective or damaged window. Within hours or days or months, you may have a cracked window on your hands. The glass company doesn't care that it's brand new and cost you $900+, you have film on it, they are sure that is what caused the breakage and now you will have to pay up to replace that brand new window you just bought. Same goes for seal failure. Now, had you had it professionally installed with an extended warranty that would have replaced your original glass warranty, all you would have had to do, would be to call your tinter, let him know what happened, and depending on the type of coverage you have, it could be covered 100%. New glass, installation and reapplication of film. Had you been one of my customers, no matter how much the window replacement would be, it would not have cost you one thin dime.

Now for some specs on the glass industry. According to those I have spoken to in the glass and film world, the national average for glass (that is untinted) is 10% of all glass made, will fail in the first 5 years. (Seals and breakage). The national average for tinted windows that fail is around 2 1/2%. What this means to the average consumer, IMHO is that if you will be spending a fair amount on glass, there is a pretty decent possibility that you may have to have a unit or two replaced within a year or so. That has certainly been my experience working on new houses. Do you think there would be some merit in paying a little more for a tint job, to enable you to continue to keep that lifetime seal/breakage warranty in place in your new home? It wouldn't take too many blown windows to pay for the tint job. That is just one of the reasons why I would go professionally. In addition to this, is the fact that a pro job will also come with a film warranty, should be a lifetime warranty if it is a decent film type. If your selling a house every 2 years, then most of this is a moot point anyway as NO warranties extend past the original owner, but it sorta sounded like your house down the road was a dreamhouse you'd like to live in for a while.

On to another topic that hasn't been discussed much - the differences in film types. With window film, it is not all about performance. It's also about aesthetics, and a good portion of your decision should be devoted to this issue imo. The windows in your home are one of THE most important things in your home. Your windows allow you to let you see the world, or the world see you, or not. The type of film you use can have a huge impact on this. Your view and lifestyle should come into the equation on what type of film you use.

Do you mind if the aesthetics of your home changes? If you use a dark silver type material, all the windows will take on a "cheap" silver look, if you don't do some windows and do others, now you will have a checkerboard look - not the nicest. Some housing communites will not allow you to use these types of materials because of the fact that they are so ugly! Now from the inside, you may be able to cut 70 to 80% of the heat, but you now have a very dark house, everything inside your house reflects itself into the windows, making it harder to look out, as you are looking through a fair amount of "noise" from all your interior furnishings reflected on the glass. And this is just in the day time. At night, all you will see with your lights on is big old plate glass mirrors. So much for the view of the city lights! And if someone happened to be standing in your yard looking in, 5 feet from your window, you'd never know it, as you can't see out anymore, unless you switch off the lights.

So far you are saying, yeah, so what I'm ok with that. Well, that's great! But what if you could get a professionally installed product that would allow nearly half your existing light to remain, (just think of what a house with all but 10 to 15% of the existing light left will be like in the winter when its raining for weeks on end - can you spell d - r - e - a- r - y ? You will with dark film!) 70% of the heat reduced, 98% of the infrafred reduced, 99% of the UV and....you can tint one window and not the one next to it and it won't scream at you that one is done and one is not, as this film does not have a shine to it. And...you can still see out at night! Yes, it is a little darker than before, and since glass has the inherent ability to cause reflection, it will be somewhat maximized since, you've darkened it some what, but you will still be able to see the city lights and the guy in the front yard. So, in plain english, lets compare the two types of film.

One is dark and shiny, one allows nearly half the light in and has no shine.

According to the specs, these films both cut the same heat and uv. One film has no warranty and won't offer glass protection, one offers it for both film and glass. One film is very noticeable, inside, outside, and will greatly affect the incoming light. The other you will be hard pressed to know it's there, much less have it affect your views. One is very inexpensive and requires homeowner appliction, the other is pricy, but hassle free. Just depends on your lifestyle which one you choose.

There are many other films out there, some materials are nearly clear, with an 8% light reduction, 57% heat reduction, 99% uv and no shine, no reflectivity, and if you looked at two windows side by side, you'd be real hard pressed to know which one was tinted.

Tinting is an art, sure it can be done by a diy, but there are alot of subtle differences in the outcome. I could probably practice a bit and paint my own car with krylon, and you know, it would come out half decent (I did it once long ago, and it wasn't bad at all, even got a good match) but I'd never think for a moment that the job was as good as what I would have paid for at a body shop. They would have charged a bundle, compared to the cost of the krylon, and my time. But the finished product would have been miles apart. Guess it would depend on the value of my car and my level of expectation for the completed job. If I was happy with the longevity and performance of krylon, why go to the body shop? But, wonder how it would go if I went to a body shop and asked them about the quality of krylon and if they could give me any good reasons why not to use it. I can only imagine! It would be a hoot! Especially if I defended my ability to be able to do it, as it had come out pretty darn good! Think they might look at me a little askance? On the other hand, that krylon I put on my trooper years ago, did hold up well, and it was a close match. Of course the paint on the vehicle had gone to hell long before so it wasn't like I started with anything too great in the first place. But, hey it worked, and so will Gilla! At this point in my life, should something have damaged my '05 Duramax, I wouldn't be using krylon to fix it. But to each his own!

Hope some of this has been able to offer you something. When you are ready to build your dream home, I would recommend you get several estimates from professionals, even if you choose not to use them, they can educate you on what's available and what the differences are. Should you go the Gila route again, thats great, but just don't limit yourself by not taking advantage of the info a professional can offer. Good luck! And props to you for attempting to educate yourself as much as possible.

And last but not least....Long Live Krylon!!!

Edited June 30, 2005 by Rama

July 1, 2005

Rama

your post should have been the 1st one. VERY well said. :nope

Kemble · July 1, 2005

much props on a long informed post :nope

July 1, 2005

great post Rama :nope

TINT · July 1, 2005

good post rama,

shattered-that avatar is funny as heck :nope

July 1, 2005

Rama,

Thank you so much. That is almost everything I am looking for.

With that, I think it will be a slam dunk to convince my wife that professional installation is the only way to go on the windows for the new place.

I'll definitely take the suggestion to get a professional's opinion or two before deciding what to do.

Right now, my thought is to only put film on South, West and East windows. And to get the type of film that is as bright as possible, but with some heat protection, which rules out GILA and all silver/reflective films. That is, I *will* be concerned with aesthetics in the new house and the thermal gain/loss will not be as important as maintaining the light source and avoiding the mirror effect. So instead of shooting for 70-80% reflection/absorbtion and 30-40% transmission, I'd much rather have 50-60% of the first and 70-80% of the latter. It sounds like that is possible from what I've read. If not, I don't need to refine those numbers now. They are "good enough", I would think.

Thanks again.

George

July 1, 2005

Glad I could help. When you get closer to your build time frame, hang onto my number if you'd like, I would be happy to suggest to you a place to start, what types of products will offer you what you are looking for, and possibly a dealer referral. Click on my catolog entry, you'll find my number. They are many types of dealers, not all of us will have the answers you need, as you've seen in the last 3 pages of this thread. If you are dealing with someone who can't offer you high light transmission films that are high performing non-reflectives, keep looking.

My business philosophy is to educate, so my clients can make informed choices. I also try to keep 3 ears open to all products availabe, as I like my clients to be able to use the best product available that will meet their needs. It means I stock alot of film types, and spend lots of time with my clients at estimates, BUT I rarely (yes, ocassionally one can't fix STUPID) have unsatisfied clients. Hopefully you can find a dealer operating from a similar perspective in your area when that time comes.

As to your desire for films that reach the need you stated above, no problem there. They exist, and perform well. You will be happy with them no doubt. However, based on the sizes of the windows, you may wish to go slightly darker aka better heat reduction on the south and west windows. Definately stay light on the east side. As to the north, usually not necessary to tint them, I rarely tint north windows unless we are dealing with unstable fabrics/materials highly susceptible to fading issues. So...tell your wife from one female to another...she doesn't want krylon...trust me on this one!

Thanks for listening, have a great 4th!